World War II Database

1. Anonymous says:
10 Oct 2008 07:28:18 AM

I flew on a turbo DC3 from West Palm Beach, FL to Cap Haitien, Haiti. It was a loud flight and it was also a little cool (temp) as it was over Christmas. I thoroughly enjoyed the flight and get to sit in the cockpit part of the time on both the flight there and back. Me and my dad have many pictures of the plane and others owned by the company (Missionary Flights International). They have 3 DC3's and on their website they have information and pictures. Here is the web site: http://www.missionaryflights.org/dc3old.htm

2.  BILL says:
13 May 2009 10:31:47 AM

Jimmy Doolittle once said: "It will last as long as there is sheet metal".
Years ago I flew in a C-47 (CAT) Civil Air Transport flying out of Taipei, Taiwan. It was an adventure, when the engines started, the whole aircraft vibarted and being a tail dragger, the pilot would swing the aircraft from left to right as he taxied. Once we were cleared and started our take-off and ever so slowly until we gained speed,then we were tail up,and airborne! The best part about the flight, was it was a low altitude flight, and you could see the country side.

3.  BILL says:
18 May 2009 09:44:23 AM

The DC-3 or( C-47 or Dakota ) in military service continues to fly in commercial and military service worldwide. Over 1,000 DC-3's are still flying. Over 35,000 DC-3's were built during World War II, with a range of 2,100 miles, a maxium speed of 185mph and able to carry 7,500 lbs of cargo. The DC-3 is one old soldier that keeps on flying, and its possible that even into the late 21st century, a DC-3 will be carrying passangers and cargo somewhere in the world.

4.  BILL says:
18 May 2009 03:48:50 PM

Turboprops on a DC-3: Its been done before in England in 1944 Armstrong Siddeley put two 1400-shp Mamba engines on a Dakota, as the British designation of their C-47. In 1950 Rolls-Royce put two Dart engines on some Dakotas in England. In 1969 Jack Conroy installed two Rolls-Royce Dart engines rated at 1600-shp the engines came from a British Viscount that was being grounded, their even was a turbo three version. With new turboprop engines, refurbished airframes, internal improvements such as new wheels and brakes, flight controls, avionics, electrical systems, cargo floors, and doors, air conditioning the DC-3 will continue to haul passangers and cargo well into the 21st century.

5.  BILL says:
20 May 2009 01:52:53 PM

In 1967 I went to the Paris Air Show amoung all the Military hardware was a Turbo DC-3 I guess after World War II every airport had a DC-3 on the flight line. Being interested in Engineering I spent alot of time looking at all the aircraft systems, that most people pass by such as landing gear, electrical systems, hydraulic lines and studying the overall aircraft design in detail. Did the same thing looking at the Russian aircraft one crewmember "said Nyet, Nyet" waving his hands, I said "Dosveedaniya",and walked away still looking around, as I left the aircraft,I bet Dmitri was thinking, "The Ugly American".

6.  Bill says:
27 Apr 2010 03:01:16 PM

Did You Know...

The first relief flight to arrive in Haiti
after the Earthquake, was a DC-3 flying from St. Lucie County Airport, Florida.
The old girl still does yoman service, she's
available, she's capable and still useful.
Call her by any name the DC-3, Super DC-3,
C-47, R4D, Gooney Bird or the Dakota she
flies on and on.

"The only replacement for a DC-3, is another
DC-3". Today about 1,000 DC-3's are still in
operation. Donald Douglas, would be proud.

A DC-3 by any other name, is still a DC-3.
The Russians built the Lisunov Li-2.
The Japanese built the Nakajima DC-2/L2D2
also built by Showa/L2D3, as the Navy Type O
transport. Nakajima built 71 and Showa built
416 aircraft.

7.  Bill says:
19 Jun 2010 03:18:05 PM

On November 19, 1946 a USAAF C-47 crashed in the Alps, and one of the flying oddities of
aviation history, belly landed in full flight
without loss of life, on a high plateau. Several days later everyone was rescued never before had a aircraft crashed in the Alps without killing all aboard.

Weather closed in and for the next twelve
days heavy snowstorms covered the whole area.
When pilots flew over the crash site no trace of the airplane could be found.
The Swiss went back and searched for the C-47
they located the plane, and opened the hatch
over the cockpit,and placed a sealed capsule
inside telling the history of this event.
The plane will sink slowly through the ice until it reaches a point were it will slide downhill, and come out the bottom intact.

It has been estimated it will take about six hundred years to do this to happen. Sometime after the turn of the 26th century, (In the year 2525 if man is still alive, and women has survived they will find) the C-47
and it will make headlines again.
Who knows, the old girl just might be put back in flying status and truly be the last of her kind.

8.  Bill says:
22 Jun 2010 08:13:38 AM

The DC-3 has flown over 100 Billion miles,
and carried over 700 Million passangers.
In 1936 you could fly coast-to-coast 15 hrs.
westbound, and 19 hrs. eastbound, round trip
for $269.90.
The DC-3 was the first commercial passanger
aircraft,to have kitchen facilities that served hot food. The passangers would enjoy
his or her food served on Syracuse china,
and real silverware. The fun part was walking
to the aircraft and boarded, people were in
suites and beautiful dresses, it was a time
long passed,it was the Golden Age of Aviation.

During April 1944, the Douglas plant in Oklahoma City built 1.8 C-47's per hour.
Plants in Oklahoma City and Long Beach, built
573 complete C-47's in 31 working days,thats
about 18.5 airplanes a day!
The Long Beach plant alone built in the same month built 415 C-47's and 120 B-17's.
Douglas delivered 2,000 C-47's by April 1944
in time for the June 6, 1944 invasion of
Europe.

9.  Bill says:
22 Jun 2010 09:49:11 AM

In 1948 the Russians blocked all ground and water ways to Berlin, the Allied response
was a airlift for 15 months, the C-47's flew
85% of the total supply missions.
Other aircraft were used for the airlift,even
converted wartime bombers. One C-47 flew with
8,000 pounds of cargo, well over its design
limit, and another flew with 13,500 lbs!
C-47's made about 12,000 round trips between
W.Germany and Berlin one C-47 flew continuously for 327 hours and 27 minutes!

10. ZJane says:
29 Sep 2010 06:30:20 PM

RE: #7 My great uncle was on that flight. I just viewed a clip of the end of the rescue in the WPA's online film library and have recently read Mrs. Tate's book about the event, Twelve Walked Away. Thanks for providing the end of the (plane's) story.

11. Andy Richards Bristol UK says:
19 Dec 2010 09:27:28 AM

I think iys great that a design such as this was has gone on for so long like the Austin 7 and the Morris 1000 still doing the job it was built and designed for , so rugged and solid, no it maybe slow and it maybe not be so comfortable, but it will get you home, with some fairly average maintenance, it can fly with one engine shut down, and it has done so much for so long, can't wait to see them in the air again in the UK carrying passengers!!

12. abhijit rabha, IFS, Chief Conservator of Forests. says:
14 Feb 2011 05:17:17 AM

interested in the crash remnants of one C-47 that is still there in the Khonbamon Hills of Karbi Anglong, ASsam, India? it went down in 1946 May. Could this be the unfortunate one called 48307 (c/n 25568)? PLease respond. ps the *** plane had lots of bones!Regards,Abhijit Rabha, Chief Conservator of Forests.

13.  Bill says:
22 Mar 2011 07:51:44 PM

The Douglas DC-3 continues to fly carrying
paying passengers and cargo somewhere in the world today.
DC-3/Li-2 have continued to fly to remote areas of the former USSR by Aeroflot as late as the 1980s. The Russians built 3,500 with 700 given under lend-lease during WWII, other records show 7,500 were built as the Li-2,(code name CAB) by NATO but we don't really know for sure others say 20,000! but thats unreliable.
Russia never paid Douglas any fee to built the aircraft it was powered by Shvetsov Ash-62 engines of 1,000hp later more powerful engines were installed.

During WWII 10,000 DC-3/C-47s were built.
In 1940 a new DC-3 sold for $80,000 after WWII they were sold surplus for a $25,000 dollars, or less. Many post-war airlines started to fly these surplus transports some were successful others went out of business.

FLY ON, FLY ON, FLY ON AND ON...

One DC-3 that flew with both Easter and North Central Airlines, flew 12,000,000 miles! or 83,032 hours, used 550 main landing gear tires, 25,000 spark plugs, 136 engines, 9,000,000 gallons of aviation fuel and who knows how much oil, taxied 100,000
miles
After airline service, was sold and refurbished, and flew an additional 1,843 hours as a corporate aircraft. The last USAF C-47 was retired in 1979, some foreign air forces still use the C-47 about 400 DC-3s are still in commerical service or private ownership, some sources list about 1,000 aircraft, in various conditions.

IT WASN'T A AIRLINE TRIP, IT WAS AN ADVENTURE

One of the best airplane trips I ever took, was flying on a CAT Civil Air Transport DC-3
out of Taipei, Taiwan in 1970, arriving at the airport early, it was like out of a old
Humphrey Bogart movie, cold and windy, rain,
fog and the airport beacon rotating around, it was another adventure in the Mysterious Orient. When I was in Vietnam, used to see
CIA C-47s and Curtiss C-46 Commandos, also a few Royal Air Lao Commerical Transports.

Call her a DC-3/C-47/R4D, Dakota, Gooney Bird
the only replanement for a DC-3, is another DC-3!

14.  Bill says:
27 Apr 2011 07:51:02 PM

NINE LIVES:

During the attack on Pearl Harbor Dec.7,1941
a Hawaiian DC-3 airliner, was coming in for a landing, and was attacked by Japaneses Zero fighters.
One of the fighters tracer rounds, hit the DC-3 and started a fire a minute later, another round hit the valve on the fire extingusher putting out the fire!

15.  Bill says:
11 Aug 2011 02:11:24 PM

C-47 SPOOK: TO WIN THE HEARTS AND MINDS

Fifty C-47s were supplied to the French by the U.S. during the First Indochina War some of the aircraft were used to fly secret propaganda missions.
Aircraft were bare metal with gloss black
undersides, rudder and wing tips were yellow
with red stripes, with Vietnamese slogans as
(VIET-MINH CONG-SAN) painted on the fuselage and wing undersides.
Aircraft flew at 5,000ft. and would broadcast
messages about 4-6 hours dropping propaganda leaflets.

Did you know:
The U.S. became involved in Vietnam in early 1953 when it sent teams of mechanics to help the French maintain their U.S. supplied C-47s

UNDER NEW MANAGEMENT:

After the fall of South Vietnam, April 1975, an unknown number of AC-47 and C-47s were captured by the North Vietnamese. The fate of the survivors, or if any of the aircraft are still operational is unknown.

16. Susank says:
30 Oct 2011 12:32:06 PM

Regarding comments #7 and #10 concerning the crash landing, was there an issue involving navigational error related to the ground beacons? There was a similar Alpine crash earlier in the same month of a B-17 that was off-course and found the side of an alpine peak. There was a similar crash two months earlier on a peak east of Grenoble.

Also, the B-17 was swallowed by the glacier and parts, include remains of the crew, were first found in 1972 - the prediction in 1947 was 25 years before emergence from the glacier.

17.  Bill says:
3 Apr 2013 07:49:25 PM

TURN COAT GOONIES C-47/Li-2:

The Lisunov Li-2 was a Russian built version of the Douglas DC-3/C-47, the USSR built over 6,000
some sources list 3,500 to as many as 20,000! but its a guess how many the Russians really built.


NOT ONE RUBLE:

Did you know that the Russians built their version Li-2, of the DC-3/C-47 without a license from Douglas and didn't pay him a license fee.

Did you know that the DC-3/C-47 were also used by the Communist Chinese, the North Koreans, Laos, Cambodia and the North Vietnamese, among the many different air forces in the world, both East & West.

SURVIVOR:

Some estimates place DC-3/C-47 survivors between 800 to 1,000 still flying worldwide. A few still fly cargo in the USA and other parts of the world. While others still do yeoman service as nostalgia & sightseeing trips...

18.  Bill says:
6 Apr 2013 08:13:44 PM

METHUSELAH WITH WINGS:

The Douglas DC-3/C-47 is an aviation icon it was
at one time the romance of a bygone era, designed and built in the 1930s and served in both war and peace.
Somewhere in the world right now, a DC-3/C-47 is flying someplace. The life of a machine is now measured in decades, the DC-3 has outlived those who built and designed her. She was replaced by faster propeller aircraft, and those were replaced by commercial jet aircraft and those jet aircraft, were replaced by still improved jet aircraft designs.

LOST & FOUND:

Parts are still available world-wide as many as 150,000 parts. Engines, wings, fuselages, ailerons, elevators, gas tanks, instruments, rudders, bearings down to nuts, bolts and washers the list goes on and on.
Other inventories come from air forces that are retiring their DC-3/C-47s. Engines can be rebuilt just so many times, and after multiple overhauls of the same engine, you can't get pressure out of the cylinders anymore.

TURBOPROPS:

These engines are lighter and smaller than the older air-cooled radial engines and add new life to the aircraft. This should add another 50, 60 or 100 years to this grand old lady but who knows
the future.

In The 23rd Century...

Once again I thank the editor/ww2db for allowing me to leave my comments...

19. Dave Head says:
7 Apr 2013 09:51:05 PM

Bill reports above: "On November 19, 1946 a USAAF C-47 crashed in the Alps".
I have read a few accounts of this crash-from the time to recently. There are several inconsistencies. Some items say it was a C53 skytrooper. A survivors says they were rescued by swiss rescue ground parties other sources say they were rescued by Swiss Army aircraft [with skis]. Two USAAF pilots claimed to have found the aircraft [Gen.Ralph Tate snr-father of the crashed aircrafts pilot and Brig.Gen Ralph Snavely], the aircraft was in fact located at 0931am 21st Nov. by a RAF bomber command Lancaster piloted by my father, Fl.Lt. Geoffrey Head- 7 squadron [pathfinders]. This was verfied a week later by the USAAF following conflicting newspaper reports.
cheers
Dave

20.  Bill says:
8 Apr 2013 08:10:06 PM

Dave thanks for your comment please read comments number 7 and 10 again, you may have missed them.
I will always try to bring the best information to ww2db, and not to rely on hearsay.
Over the past 40 years I have collected a large aviation library.

The story about the DC-3 that went down in the Alps is in print. The story of that accident was from the book titled.

"The Legendary DC-3"
By Carroll V. Glines & Wendell F. Moseley
Published by Bantam Books 1991
ISBN 0-553-29586-1

"Chapter 10" The Legend Goes On and On...the story of all this interest starts on page 190 through page 193...I'm sure other aircraft have crashed in the Alps and each a different story.

Best wishes,

Bill

21.  Bill says:
9 Apr 2013 12:01:31 PM

ANY LANDING YOU CAN WALK AWAY FROM:

Continued from comment number 20. The flight plan started at Tolin, near Vienna, Austria with stops at Munich, Germany, Strasbourg, France, Dijon, France and Marseille-Istres, France toward its final destination Pisa, Italy.

The C-53,was known as the sky trooper, was the military version of the DC-3. The aircraft made a belly landing on the Gauli Glacier all passengers suffered bruises and bumps, but no one was serious injuries, and were very glad to be alive!
Later a Swiss Air Force Fieseler Storch landed and the rescue started...

22. Dave Head says:
10 Apr 2013 08:27:49 PM

Thanks for your feedback Bill. I am pretty sure that my information on the Swiss Alps crash of the c47 could not considered hearsay. It comes from newspaper articles of the time, a newsreel film and more importantly from my Father [& his original logbook]. I notice the book you quote was published in 1991 - a long time after the crash-but one I will try to hold of. Here is a story from one of the passengers: http://home.earthlink.net/~highjack3/mayday.htm
Here is a remarkable personal-experience story of one of the passengers, By Marguerite
Gaylord Tate.
My Cousin in England is carrying out further research and I may well get back here at some time.
cheers
Dave

23. Dave Head says:
10 Apr 2013 08:37:44 PM


Hi Bill here is my Dads account of the C47 Swiss Alps crash:
On November 20th 1946, as air/sea rescue officer for our station, I received a request for assistance in searching for a crashed DC3 (Dakota) which had disappeared whilst flying over the Swiss Alps. We were told it contained high ranking American Officers and wives. Within 25 minutes we had dispatched our stand-by aircraft. That night with the search not locating the crashed aircraft I planned to join the search. When I filed my flight plan with group HQ I was told that further searching would be useless. With the lapse of time and the low temperature it was their opinion that any survivor of the crash would have died. My own CO however told me to go for it and this we did, taking off early on Thursday 21st with food supplies and blankets.

The search area had been established by 3 radio stations plotting faint signals from the crashed aircraft. After 7 ½ hours in the air we gave up for the day without any sign of the crashed aircraft among the many mountains we searched.

We landed at search HQ at Istres in southern France. Early next morning we were requested to search an area about 50 miles north of the original area because during the night a 4th radio station had plotted a bearing further north of the original area.

We arrived over the search area only to find it almost completely covered with cloud, with gaps here and there. At 9.30am my rear gunner called out “circle skip- I think I have spotted it”. We then circled over a gap in the cloud and the mid-upper gunner confirmed that he saw what he though was a crashed aircraft. The cloud closed over and we lost sight of it. The navigator was unable to obtain an accurate fix of our position because of the radio interference from the mountains, so we decided to fly a fixed speed and direction course until clear of the interference. This we did-the navigator plotted a radar position and backtracked to plot the position of the crash site.

We landed at Istres and gave search HQ all our information, which was relayed to all other search centres and search aircraft, of which there were approximately 100. Later in the afternoon the weather was clearing so we took off and headed for the crash site. Before we reached it other aircraft radioed in that they were over the position we had given and that the aircraft was indeed there. It was on a glacier at an altitude of approximately 11,000 ft. We all dropped our supplies and left it to ground parties to effect the rescue.

24. Dave Head says:
10 Apr 2013 08:43:08 PM

www.itnsource.com is a treasure trove of news footage-with a large section on WWII. The Swiss Alps C47 crash interview can be found by searching on that site Ref: BGU901018721.
cheers.

25. Dave Head says:
11 Apr 2013 09:53:47 PM

Here is a bit more about the crash and the rescue: http://www.milhist.net/88/swiss.html

Here is a newspaper article of the time:
“ÜS Air Force HQ in Frankfurt said a British Lancaster bomber made the initial discovery....
”http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1338&dat=19461121&id=PuNXAAAAIBAJ&sjid=l_UDAAAAIBAJ&pg=6741,5447373

cheers, Dave

26.  Bill says:
15 Apr 2013 08:09:13 PM

Hello Dave:

Thanks for getting back to me covering the crash of the DC-3/C-53. Glad we can cover such a long ago event. I'm glad to see any comment here at ww2db, it has always been my interest to bring little known facts about WWII and other events in the post-war world.

Your added comments brings more information,than I had available and its interesting to read any follow up information. This has been one of the disappointment's that I've experienced leaving my comments here at ww2db the very few comments about what I've left.
Thanks for adding to the story any information is not only helpful to those of us who leave such information, but to the ones who read and learn something about the Douglas DC-3 they never knew before. If you have any other information to add to ww2db I would enjoy reading your comments.

The best airplane trip I ever took, was flying out of Taipei, Taiwan on a China Air Lines C-47.
It was the cargo model equipped w/double-doors.
Arriving at the airport, it was like a scene out of a Humphrey Bogart movie early in the AM cold, windy with rain the airport beacon light rotating through the rain and fog. It added something to my experiences in the Mysterious Orient during the late 1960s/early 1970s.

Other propeller-driven aircraft that have always been my favorites along with the DC-3,that I've flown in as a passenger are the Lockheed L-1049 Constellation and the Lockheed L-188 Turbo-Prop Electra. Those were the days when you could look
at the flight deck, take a few photos and maybe even talk with the Captain for a few minutes...
I was always the last one out.

Best wishes

Bill

27. Dave Head says:
17 Apr 2013 01:30:57 AM

Thanks for your comments Bill, yeah flying in a large metal tube is not as much fun nowdays. The best flying I did was topdressing in a cresco [single turboprop]. I think we have some of the best topdressing pilots here due to the topography and the really primative airstrips.
I have seen all the WWII + aircraft at Duxford in England but you can't get close or in many of them.
cheers

28.  Bill says:
17 Apr 2013 10:03:10 AM

Hello Dave:

Thank you for taking the time to answer me here at ww2db. I agree flying isn't what it used to be.
I remember as a child traveling back to the East coast in 1958, on a Douglas DC-7 people were dressed in their best clothes, ate from real plates with real silverware, it was an event.

Today its like flying on a bus with wings people dressed like their going to Disneyland.
Remember a few decades ago you could walk up to the counter check in your bags, get your ticket and run if necessary because your flight is always leaving in five minutes! those were the days. Take that short walk to your flight, walk up the stairs it was all part of the adventure...

Go to Air Shows now got to wait in line, a long line have your coolers and bags checked.
You can't bring this, or you can't bring that,
I've traveled to very few shows now just waiting to get in and waiting to get out becomes just too much. But the times, they are a changing!

29. ZJane says:
15 Jan 2014 08:31:39 PM

Dave,

I haven't checked back here for awhile; what a surprise to find the information you provide!

Both parts you mention about the Swiss rescue are correct. A " ski plane" did transfer survivors (injured and weakened) off the glacier, and there were also rescuers who skied in. Fragility of the landing spot was a concern. My great uncle was fit enough to descend on skis with the Swiss rescuers.

He was the grandson of a Cornishman who emigrated to Upper Michigan, so it is nice to hear about your dad's and the British contribution to the rescue.

Today, the whole story would have played out on CNN, but at the time, newsreels were shown before the movies, and the neighbors saw my great uncle on the screen and went running to my my great grandmother's house to drag her to the theater.

ZJ

30. Thomas McGlinchey says:
17 May 2014 08:58:19 PM

re #12 ...
thank you for your efforts. I hope to be able to follow this story. My father was a navigator serving in CBI.
Updates: http://www.nagalandpost.com/ShowStory.aspx?npoststoryiden=UzEwMzQ4NTA%3D-3dIKbX0ELFA%3D
and then:
http://newsblaze.com/story/20130425183908sush.nb/topstory.html
I do hope that the US Military will continue efforts to bring all of our heroes home.

31. Kevin says:
18 Nov 2017 08:36:00 AM

The date 18 Nov 1949 contains a notation that "A Douglas C-47 Globemaster I..." I believe you mean a C-74 Globemaster as the C-47 was the Skytrain and could not carry that load.

32.  C. Peter Chen says:
19 Nov 2017 11:53:38 AM

Keven, the error has been corrected, thank you for pointing that out.